EMP

[Supervisor42]

PS: Transformers are at significant risk of destruction and any long cable assemblies .
The 2nd and 3rd order effects of this are legion.

No they are not.
Every transformer is inside a huge steel container. It makes a faraday cage look like cheese-cloth.
Long cable lines: all come into the substation to a lightening arrestor (spark gap) followed by a circuit breaker.
A major EMP occurs every time there is a nearby lightening strike. That's why your lights blink.
I recommend spending some time with your electric utility guys.
They dance with this stuff every month.
Some lines even take a million-volt direct hit and almost all survive just fine.
If you want to worry, think about microwave communications, and it dealing a death-blow to Alexa.
All of those transmitter/receivers are vulnerable.

 

[Chaosdawn]

Yeah, when I suggested the book it was in reference to the social aspects of the breakdown of society rather than as a blueprint for prepping. It is a fiction book after all.

 

[Morgan101]

I liked the book. I can't comment on the science. I don't know enough about the science to be dangerous. I agree with Backpacker. I thought it accurately outlined the human condition. How people will react in a crisis. How some politicians will try to take over. How there will be misinformation coming from sources to protect their own interests rather than the interest of the public. How are you going to deal with crime?

Yes, it is a work of fiction, but it raises many points that should be thought through, discussed, and evaluated.

 

[SheepDog]

I studied and researched the science for over 20 years. Fiction books are really good about the extreme actions of groups but rarely show both extremes. Some will help the community and others will take advantage.
The science of a coronal mass ejection is fully known.
It will effect long supply lines and transformers and also the generators that power the grid. It won't produce massive voltages. As a matter of fact the voltages from the solar EMP will be relatively low but the amps are extremely high. This causes transmission lines to ultimately melt. It also causes transformers and generators to have the windings burn which short out these big devices. A spark gap requires high voltage so they are worthless in an EMP. The breakers are "slow-blow" devices to prevent random outages and only some of the many sub-stations are equipped auto-trip breakers. Most have to be tripped either electronically from the control center or manually at the sub-station.

I want to remind you that I am talking only about a solar event in my above explanation. A nuclear EMP is an entirely different problem.
In a solar event your car will be fine, all your electronics will be fine and your appliances will be fine. You won't have any power but that is because the grid will be down.

 

[LadyLocust]

I have an EMP question spurred by all the talk about the floaty thing from Xi.
I realize there are different kinds of EMPs and I realize I am mostly ignorant on the subject so I’m trying to be at least a little less ignorant as to what to do.
I’ve read/heard things about what to do in the event of an emp, but I’m just wondering what you all think and do. I’m not as concerned about the grid per se, but duct tape around the doors and windows, cover garden areas with plastic, take iron and red wine etc. How much of this is accurate? What is the plan? What things should we have that might not be covered by other preps.?
Thanks!

 

[Caribou]

I have an EMP question spurred by all the talk about the floaty thing from Xi.
I realize there are different kinds of EMPs and I realize I am mostly ignorant on the subject so I’m trying to be at least a little less ignorant as to what to do.
I’ve read/heard things about what to do in the event of an emp, but I’m just wondering what you all think and do. I’m not as concerned about the grid per se, but duct tape around the doors and windows, cover garden areas with plastic, take iron and red wine etc. How much of this is accurate? What is the plan? What things should we have that might not be covered by other preps.?
Thanks!

An EMP is an electronic pulse. It is like lightening. It is there and gone, having caused whatever damage it caused. If lightening struck your power line every appliance, that was plugged in, would be fried, same thing. Unless it came from a ground burst nuclear blast there is no radioactive fallout to worry about.

 

[Morgan101]

What things should we have that might not be covered by other preps.?

A Faraday Cage or Bag may be something that would protect electronic devices that you might otherwise not have in your preps.

By definition: A Faraday cage or Faraday shield is an enclosure used to block electromagnetic fields. A Faraday shield may be formed by a continuous covering of conductive material, or in the case of a Faraday cage, by a mesh of such materials. Faraday cages are named after scientist Michael Faraday, who invented them in 1836.

You could research what items would be good to store and protect from an EMP. Cell phones, although I don't know who you would call, laptops, maybe fobs with important information, a radio, or communication devices. If you did a search on Faraday cages you could find who sells them or how to make your own, and probably even a list of what to keep in them.

Other than that I can't think of anything that would be different from your normal preps. Plan on not having any electricity for a long time.

 

[BBLife]

I'm building out to have a nice happy and enjoyable non-electric needing life. The only thing I've prepped in the event of a total electric blackout and all is fried is I have a 100% self contained solar pump system that I bought and put in my basement which is protected from an EMP. I'd pull that out and setup so that it can fill my upper cistern during the day and then I can gravity feed the house for running water. Outside of that, I'll be happy as a greased pig in the rain with no power.

 

[LadyLocust]

I think what I'd heard was in line with the radio-active sort so protecting one's self. Maybe that's different all together.
@BBLife That's an awesome feeling isn't it? I was about there at one point but have started over - think that's a point of contention for me so doing what I can where I am.

 

[angie_nrs]

In a widespread EMP, I think it would be difficult to determine the cause (and to gauge your reaction to it) due to lack of credible information at the time of the event. I would think most radio stations would be out, as would internet and TV. Perhaps some Ham operators would be working, but I'd think many of those would be affected as well? Even if some of them were still operational, it wouldn't mean that the operators would have the answers. And none of that would even matter if I didn't have a radio that made it though the event unharmed. I have some radios stashed away in what I hope is an EMP proof place, but I have no idea if it's good enough or not.

So, if the grid went down, would you also prepare for fallout due to not knowing what caused the power to go out?
Hmmmmm......

I would dig out my radiation detectors and put in fresh batteries. I'd want to know the minute that levels started to climb, if at all. Until then, I think I would be instituting my 12 hour plan. Hopefully I'd be home and so would hubby. Otherwise, I'd be making quick plans on how to get home.

That balloon went right over the center of our nation. It could have been catastrophic. I'm not one of those that think it can't happen.....b/c clearly, under this president.....it can.

 

[BBLife]

I think what I'd heard was in line with the radio-active sort so protecting one's self. Maybe that's different all together.
@BBLife That's an awesome feeling isn't it? I was about there at one point but have started over - think that's a point of contention for me so doing what I can where I am.

I'm one of those crazy people that LOVE power outages. To me, being without electricity is about as free feeling as it gets.

 

[SheepDog]

There are two types of EMPs.
Solar EMP is caused by a solar mass ejection colliding with and distorting the Earth's magnetic field. A low voltage high amperage current is produced in long (miles long) grid conductors that causes heat that damages the wires, transformers and generators that are connected to the grid. The damage area can be small (100 square miles) or large enough to cover the entire planet.
What you can do to prevent damage is to disconnect from the grid. The power controllers can prevent damage by shutting it down and grounding the grid to shunt the power to ground harmlessly.

The second type of EMP is the HEMP or high altitude nuclear detonation.
This kind of EMP has three parts or pulses.
The E1 pulse is a super fast rise pulse that is caused by the free gamma radiation hitting the air molecules and knocking the electrons off. The freed electrons are caught in the magnetic field of the earth while the atmosphere becomes a positive polarity cold plasma charged to 50000 V/M. The fast rise time and high voltage destroys the junction of semiconductors. The E1 pulse destroys diodes (all electronic devices with diode junctions) in less time than it takes to see the high altitude blast. In order to make an HEMP the blast has to detonate at least 30 to 35 miles high. The higher it is when detonated the larger the area that is affected. NOTE: the high altitude detonation of a nuclear bomb will not directly injure people and the blast will stay in space.
There are only two ways to protect your electronics from the E1 pulse. You can build a wave guide that slows or stops the pulse from getting to your electronics (way above my pay grade) or you can protect your electronics with envelopes (boxes) of multiple layers of dielectrics (good insulators) and very good conductors (gold, silver, copper or Aluminum). Faraday cages or boxes of lower conductors will not work. Faraday cages are meant to stop sparks by capturing them and moving them to ground. A Faraday cage won't stop Plasma and since the E1 pulse charges the atmosphere and the ground to about 30 feet deep you have no way to ground it. It is not like lightning. It doesn't travel through the air, it is the air!
The E2 pulse will burn the small transformers atop your power poles. The EFFECT is similar to a lightning strike but covers a large area (the area of the E1 pulse) rather than a single spot. The E2 pulse can be stopped with common lightning arrestors as long as they were not destroyed by the E1 pulse.
The E3 pulse is exactly like the solar EMP except that it will only cover the area covered by the blast. This part of the HEMP is the only part that is connected to the strength of the blast. The E3 pulse can be so weak that it passes unnoticed or as strong as a very large solar mass ejection but it will always be contained within the area of the line of sight of the blast.

 

[Rick]

No they are not.
Every transformer is inside a huge steel container. It makes a faraday cage look like cheese-cloth.
Long cable lines: all come into the substation to a lightening arrestor (spark gap) followed by a circuit breaker.
A major EMP occurs every time there is a nearby lightening strike. That's why your lights blink.
I recommend spending some time with your electric utility guys.
They dance with this stuff every month.
Some lines even take a million-volt direct hit and almost all survive just fine.
If you want to worry, think about microwave communications, and it dealing a death-blow to Alexa.
All of those transmitter/receivers are vulnerable.

I am pleased to hear our transformers are so well protected.
I did not wish to be cavalier about EMP but anything that is at the end of a long time should be vulnerable to EMP.

I believe we will all find out in good time.
In any event the 2nd and 3rd order effects will be catastrophic even if not all tropes from Post-Apoc SF apply.

 

[Neb]

I am pleased to hear our transformers are so well protected.
I did not wish to be cavalier about EMP but anything that is at the end of a long time should be vulnerable to EMP.

I believe we will all find out in good time.
In any event the 2nd and 3rd order effects will be catastrophic even if not all tropes from Post-Apoc SF apply.

Agreed.

See Roscoe Bartlett from 12 years ago.

https://www.politico.com/magazine/story/2014/01/roscoe-bartlett-congressman-off-the-grid-101720
Ben

 

[Caribou]

I am pleased to hear our transformers are so well protected.
I did not wish to be cavalier about EMP but anything that is at the end of a long time should be vulnerable to EMP.

My parents are at the end of the line. I gave Dad a whole house surge protector that sat on the bench for a couple of years. When the power came back on the surge was far higher that usual. It fried every appliance in the house. I got a call from Dad, "How did you say I was supposed to wire in that surge suppressor?"

 

[Southernsurvivalist]

Set up a 19th century homestead and live it. You can still add internet service to use until the EMP hits.

 

[lonewolf]

I'm one of those crazy people that LOVE power outages. To me, being without electricity is about as free feeling as it gets.

yep, you and me both. keep it simple.