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While doing more research for the THH project I came across this video. I think it wold make a very interesting topic for discussion. I welcome all your comments.
GMO Seeds, Just the Facts, a Final Discussion
- Thread starter TMT Tactical
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A good informative video and all the GMO products are a concern in our supermarkets.
There is merit based on all of this to save your own seeds as we do here to make sure we have a continuance of the older styles of vegetable and other seeds and be aware that you cannot save F1 varieties of seeds as we get here in sweet corn and other varieties. (incidentally all sweet corn varieties are hybrid seeds). I found this out through trial and error myself. At least I know that my saved seeds are viable and will grow year in year out.
Incidentally we don't have GMO seeds commercially available for purchase apart from a select few farmers who are doing trials on GMO at the moment. There have been a number of cases though of GMO farms being beside organic farms that have lost their organic accreditation through seeds drifting on to their properties too.
There is merit based on all of this to save your own seeds as we do here to make sure we have a continuance of the older styles of vegetable and other seeds and be aware that you cannot save F1 varieties of seeds as we get here in sweet corn and other varieties. (incidentally all sweet corn varieties are hybrid seeds). I found this out through trial and error myself. At least I know that my saved seeds are viable and will grow year in year out.
Incidentally we don't have GMO seeds commercially available for purchase apart from a select few farmers who are doing trials on GMO at the moment. There have been a number of cases though of GMO farms being beside organic farms that have lost their organic accreditation through seeds drifting on to their properties too.
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We learned a lot from Bobby in the video. he is very smart. He tries to stick with non GMOs.
The video is good information about the lack of threat from the GMO market. He down plays the importance of heirloom seeds and states that open pollination seeds are OK. Open pollinated seeds are - possibly hybrids and may not give you the same crop next year using seeds you collected from the plants.
I am not concerned about GMO seeds. What I care about is having seeds from my crops that will provide me the same crop that I had the first time. Hybrid seeds are not GMO it is cross pollinated seed that have been selected for specific properties. The problem is that the seeds produced by hybrid plants do not produce the same plants that you grew the first time. The seeds that are produced will make the constituent plants and not the hybrid plant. That is why I use only heirloom seeds when I purchase seeds. From that point on I use seeds that I collect from my own plants. I buy very few seeds only to introduce new crops. I make sure that they are heirloom seeds.
If you buy seeds each year then hybrid seeds are fine for you - until you need to collect seeds from your plants to feed yourself if seeds are not available at the retail level.
I am not concerned about GMO seeds. What I care about is having seeds from my crops that will provide me the same crop that I had the first time. Hybrid seeds are not GMO it is cross pollinated seed that have been selected for specific properties. The problem is that the seeds produced by hybrid plants do not produce the same plants that you grew the first time. The seeds that are produced will make the constituent plants and not the hybrid plant. That is why I use only heirloom seeds when I purchase seeds. From that point on I use seeds that I collect from my own plants. I buy very few seeds only to introduce new crops. I make sure that they are heirloom seeds.
If you buy seeds each year then hybrid seeds are fine for you - until you need to collect seeds from your plants to feed yourself if seeds are not available at the retail level.
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Being a city boy (okay old guy) I am still learning about the difference between plant types (GMO, Hybrid, heirloom, open pollinated, etc). Since the THH project is being designed to be a very long term self sufficient compound, The crops must be renewable from collected seeds, no store bought resupply. I did find the video presented many good points and am hoping the members here will post more info.
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First half of the video is good, but I had to rest my ears.
I was in a book store found a book on sale & bought it, it is Titled Hybrid.
It tells that all garden seeds have been hybrid in europeans countries in the 1700 & 1800 as well as the USA in 1800 & 1900.
So the man right about So called heirloom,open pollinated seeds, it is just a classification for breeder, they are all hybrid for hundreds of years.
Anyone that believe these classifications are not from Hybrid seed that breeders have been breeding for many years, need to read the book.
So they are all HYBRIDS, then there are the GMO, that are really bad, but no one know why, they just are.
I do not use GMO's, but still have not found any proof they are bad.
I do know a man who use them, according to him you can get them though the mail, but they cost 10 time what all Hybrid seed cost.
Now that is a good reason not to use them, beside the fact the market has tons of proven safe hybrids that we all can collect at a good price.
I like trying new hybrids, it is the best way to find good plants that do well in your soil, climate & gardening style.
rid
THE HISTORY AND SCIENCE OF PLANT BREEDING
NOEL KINGSBURY
512 pages | 6 x 9 | © 2009
Disheartened by the shrink-wrapped, Styrofoam-packed state of contemporary supermarket fruits and vegetables, many shoppers hark back to a more innocent time, to visions of succulent red tomatoes plucked straight from the vine, gleaming orange carrots pulled from loamy brown soil, swirling heads of
… Read More
I was in a book store found a book on sale & bought it, it is Titled Hybrid.
It tells that all garden seeds have been hybrid in europeans countries in the 1700 & 1800 as well as the USA in 1800 & 1900.
So the man right about So called heirloom,open pollinated seeds, it is just a classification for breeder, they are all hybrid for hundreds of years.
Anyone that believe these classifications are not from Hybrid seed that breeders have been breeding for many years, need to read the book.
So they are all HYBRIDS, then there are the GMO, that are really bad, but no one know why, they just are.
I do not use GMO's, but still have not found any proof they are bad.
I do know a man who use them, according to him you can get them though the mail, but they cost 10 time what all Hybrid seed cost.
Now that is a good reason not to use them, beside the fact the market has tons of proven safe hybrids that we all can collect at a good price.
I like trying new hybrids, it is the best way to find good plants that do well in your soil, climate & gardening style.
rid
THE HISTORY AND SCIENCE OF PLANT BREEDING
NOEL KINGSBURY
512 pages | 6 x 9 | © 2009
Disheartened by the shrink-wrapped, Styrofoam-packed state of contemporary supermarket fruits and vegetables, many shoppers hark back to a more innocent time, to visions of succulent red tomatoes plucked straight from the vine, gleaming orange carrots pulled from loamy brown soil, swirling heads of
… Read More
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Lets try this again.
***
Paper $20.00ISBN: 9780226437132Published November 2011
Cloth $38.00ISBN: 9780226437040Published October 2009
E-book $10.00 to $20.00About E-booksISBN: 9780226437057Published October 2009Also Available From
Hybrid
THE HISTORY AND SCIENCE OF PLANT BREEDING
NOEL KINGSBURY
512 pages | 6 x 9 | © 2009
Disheartened by the shrink-wrapped, Styrofoam-packed state of contemporary supermarket fruits and vegetables, many shoppers hark back to a more innocent time, to visions of succulent red tomatoes plucked straight from the vine, gleaming orange carrots pulled from loamy brown soil, swirling heads of green lettuce basking in the sun.
With Hybrid, Noel Kingsbury reveals that even those imaginary perfect foods are themselves far from anything that could properly be called natural; rather, they represent the end of a millennia-long history of selective breeding and hybridization. Starting his story at the birth of agriculture, Kingsbury traces the history of human attempts to make plants more reliable, productive, and nutritious—a story that owes as much to accident and error as to innovation and experiment. Drawing on historical and scientific accounts, as well as a rich trove of anecdotes, Kingsbury shows how scientists, amateur breeders, and countless anonymous farmers and gardeners slowly caused the evolutionary pressures of nature to be supplanted by those of human needs—and thus led us from sparse wild grasses to succulent corn cobs, and from mealy, white wild carrots to the juicy vegetables we enjoy today. At the same time, Kingsbury reminds us that contemporary controversies over the Green Revolution and genetically modified crops are not new; plant breeding has always had a political dimension.
A powerful reminder of the complicated and ever-evolving relationship between humans and the natural world, Hybrid will give readers a thoughtful new perspective on—and a renewed appreciation of—the cereal crops, vegetables, fruits, and flowers that are central to our way of life.
Close
***
Paper $20.00ISBN: 9780226437132Published November 2011
Cloth $38.00ISBN: 9780226437040Published October 2009
E-book $10.00 to $20.00About E-booksISBN: 9780226437057Published October 2009Also Available From
Hybrid
THE HISTORY AND SCIENCE OF PLANT BREEDING
NOEL KINGSBURY
512 pages | 6 x 9 | © 2009
Disheartened by the shrink-wrapped, Styrofoam-packed state of contemporary supermarket fruits and vegetables, many shoppers hark back to a more innocent time, to visions of succulent red tomatoes plucked straight from the vine, gleaming orange carrots pulled from loamy brown soil, swirling heads of green lettuce basking in the sun.
With Hybrid, Noel Kingsbury reveals that even those imaginary perfect foods are themselves far from anything that could properly be called natural; rather, they represent the end of a millennia-long history of selective breeding and hybridization. Starting his story at the birth of agriculture, Kingsbury traces the history of human attempts to make plants more reliable, productive, and nutritious—a story that owes as much to accident and error as to innovation and experiment. Drawing on historical and scientific accounts, as well as a rich trove of anecdotes, Kingsbury shows how scientists, amateur breeders, and countless anonymous farmers and gardeners slowly caused the evolutionary pressures of nature to be supplanted by those of human needs—and thus led us from sparse wild grasses to succulent corn cobs, and from mealy, white wild carrots to the juicy vegetables we enjoy today. At the same time, Kingsbury reminds us that contemporary controversies over the Green Revolution and genetically modified crops are not new; plant breeding has always had a political dimension.
A powerful reminder of the complicated and ever-evolving relationship between humans and the natural world, Hybrid will give readers a thoughtful new perspective on—and a renewed appreciation of—the cereal crops, vegetables, fruits, and flowers that are central to our way of life.
Close
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The biggest problem I find with collecting seeds from my crops, is that you can not plant more than one variety of okra.
Unless you plant the different variety 1500 feet apart.
https://www.seedsavers.org/site/pdf/Seed Saving Guide_2017.pdf
https://www.seedsavers.org/seed-saving-chart
Even with 10 acres that would mean three or four garden plot, but someone with only 2 acres would be limited to one variety per seed cycle.
About 65 days from seed to fruit, some if you planted seeds 30 days apart, you could harvest fruit for 30 days, letting the last fruit dry in the plant.
But as soon as the new crop had bloom buds, you would have to pick ALL bloom buds from old plant as the mature pods dried.
No old blooms, no crossing, one could fill the freezer & the pots, while collecting 500-1000 seeds on 3 maybe 4 varieties.
Unless you plant the different variety 1500 feet apart.
https://www.seedsavers.org/site/pdf/Seed Saving Guide_2017.pdf
https://www.seedsavers.org/seed-saving-chart
Even with 10 acres that would mean three or four garden plot, but someone with only 2 acres would be limited to one variety per seed cycle.
About 65 days from seed to fruit, some if you planted seeds 30 days apart, you could harvest fruit for 30 days, letting the last fruit dry in the plant.
But as soon as the new crop had bloom buds, you would have to pick ALL bloom buds from old plant as the mature pods dried.
No old blooms, no crossing, one could fill the freezer & the pots, while collecting 500-1000 seeds on 3 maybe 4 varieties.
