Personal Fuel Station

[Biggkidd]

Fuel and storing fuel is or can be an issue for many of us. It's something we all rely on daily and we need a stockpile of it. Many years ago I setup a used home heating oil tank to store gas. That has worked out great allowing me to stock up on fuel for the generator when prices are lowest.

Now I feel we need more fuel storage. I'm debating setting up a personal multi fuel station for gas, diesel and possibly kerosene. I have several more of the used tanks in the 260-275 gallon range. All the pieces & parts to hook everything up including pumps, filters, hoses and such can get pretty expensive though.

There is the option to mount the tank(s) high and simply use gravity as my existing tank was done. But every kind of fuel I know of stores better with more stabile and consistent temperatures. Plus the very large bonus of out of sight out of mind. So I am leaning toward putting any additional tanks I may setup in the ground. This adds the need of a pump or pumps. If I could use one pump for all types of fuel that would be more economical but I'm not sure that's possible.

Anyway I was wondering what you all do for fuel storage?

 

[zoomzoom]

Since you're good on the gas storage (and I assume pump), here's my thoughts on diesel and kero.

Pumps for diesel/kero are significantly less cost compared to a gas pump.
I bought a Specstar which I really like (but it's no longer available on Amazon).
A similar (in function) pump is something like this on Amazon.
Damn link isn't working. Search Amazon for B07KQZ4DT7
Be advised you need to buy the hose and nozzle separate but all 3 components will run you around $100.

If you want a really inexpensive alternative, look for "shaker hose". They're around $10. You just put the brass end in your fuel, the other end in whatever you're pouring into then shake the end that's in the bulk tank up-and-down to start the siphon. Two things about this option. 1) Most only come with 6' hoses so consider your length needs and 2) In my experience, these only last about 5-10 years.

For going from smaller containers (e.g. a 5-gallon can) into an engine's fuel tank, I like this little pump.
On Amazon, search for B00WZX9G8C

 

[Weedygarden]

I don't do either. Your post reminded me of family fuel tanks. There were tanks, as you mentioned, that were elevated so filling up was gravity fed. I have no idea how much fuel they held, but maybe 250 gallons. We would drive up a tractor, combine, pickup, or whatever we were driving and fillerup. There was a diesel tank and a gas tank.

An uncle who always had the latest gadgets purchased a pump like the ones used by filling stations and had it attached to a tank that he had buried by his driveway.

Purchasing a volume of fuel must be cheaper than one tank at a time.

 

[zoomzoom]

Purchasing a volume of fuel must be cheaper than one tank at a time.

Around here, not really. They give you a cheaper price than going to the gas station but tack on a delivery fee so it balances out.

 

[Weedygarden]

Around here, not really. They give you a cheaper price than going to the gas station but tack on a delivery fee so it balances out.

When I was a child, there were local people who delivered fuel, as their job, business. A distant cousin had a business doing that in Colorado and later in Montana. One of my cousins, the son of the man who had the buried tanks, says that they drive into town to get fuel now. I see pickups with special fuel tanks on the back, probably for driving up to machinery and fueling it.

 

[Biggkidd]

@zoomzoom The one tank of gas we have is in a poor location for general use. It's hard to get at and specifically for the generator. We live off grid with solar as our primary power and generator is secondary. So I really want to setup a minimum of 1) gas tank and 1) diesel tank where they are more accessible.

@Weedygarden To this point we just buy 100+ or - gallons at a time in a transfer tank and fill the larger tank with it. Once we get a diesel tank setup we can have off road diesel delivered and possibly farm gas.

 

[zoomzoom]

So I really want to setup a minimum of 1) gas tank and 1) diesel tank where they are more accessible.

Are IBC totes an option for you?

 

[Biggkidd]

Are IBC totes an option for you?

Yes but I already have a half dozen metal fuel oil tanks on hand. We use IBC totes for water storage, never thought of using them for fuel. Wonder how the plastic would react to gas or diesel? A big bonus using the IBC totes would be the no rust factor.

 

[TeeJ]

I'm also interested in what people are thinking for this. I've been toying with the IBC tote idea as well (I also use a bunch for water). I've read they are the same plastic as gas cans, but wondered about longevity above and below ground. Anyone have experience with them? I can get QC rejects from my employer sometimes too, so I've been wondering about burying 1-2 in a concrete box culvert, but that would be quite the production to get all of that in the ground.

 

[The Lazy L]

Burying fuel tanks may make EPA mad and qualify for their requlation$

 

[Biggkidd]

Been doing a lot of research today and other than the fact that IBC totes are perfectly safe for storing any petroleum distillate. I didn't really learn anything. I did however confirm a few things.

Dark Cool below 70F and above freezing consistent temperatures are best for storing fuel so in ground or earth banked sounds like the best way. Still not sure which way I'm going to go. A gravity tank still has it's $$$ appeal.

 

[Tirediron]

Fuel and storing fuel is or can be an issue for many of us. It's something we all rely on daily and we need a stockpile of it. Many years ago I setup a used home heating oil tank to store gas. That has worked out great allowing me to stock up on fuel for the generator when prices are lowest.

Now I feel we need more fuel storage. I'm debating setting up a personal multi fuel station for gas, diesel and possibly kerosene. I have several more of the used tanks in the 260-275 gallon range. All the pieces & parts to hook everything up including pumps, filters, hoses and such can get pretty expensive though.

There is the option to mount the tank(s) high and simply use gravity as my existing tank was done. But every kind of fuel I know of stores better with more stabile and consistent temperatures. Plus the very large bonus of out of sight out of mind. So I am leaning toward putting any additional tanks I may setup in the ground. This adds the need of a pump or pumps. If I could use one pump for all types of fuel that would be more economical but I'm not sure that's possible.

Anyway I was wondering what you all do for fuel storage?

Ptu the d4 to work and build a earth berm for the tanks to sit on, best of most worlds, maybe make it look like a brush pile for shade camo

 

[Biggkidd]

Ptu the d4 to work and build a earth berm for the tanks to sit on, best of most worlds, maybe make it look like a brush pile for shade camo

Not a bad idea at all.

You know another point in our favor is not a hundred people know anyone lives back down this old logging road.

 

[Neb]

Burying fuel tanks may make EPA mad and qualify for their requlation$

I thought that a containment system was required in the event of leaks or spills.

Ben

 

[Tirediron]

I thought that a containment system was required in the event of leaks or spills.

Ben

Don't ask for permission, and thus the camoflauge

 

[Neb]

Don't ask for permission, and thus the camoflauge

Fair enough.

It may be prudent to check a delivery company to ensure they are not restricted in what types of containers they can fill. Better to find out ahead or time.

Sea story time

We excavated a short road for easy access to our private forest. Covered with gravel save for the last 20' where we had a contractor put in concrete to prevent the gravel from migrating to the hard top (my motorcycle buddy railed too many times about gravel on a roadway). And then the registered letter from the township arrived.

$1000 a day fine!

We scrambled to get a friend to cover the concrete with his bobcat and erase all of the work and cost we invested.

If I had known the "driveway" I would have opted out.

Better to know ahead of time.

Background mini rant

I could put in the driveway but I needed a permit.
I could get a permit with an optional variance for the property primary purpose.
But this primary purpose is a house.
But I don't a house there.
Building even a minimal house would require water sewage and electrical. Let's pretend the epa wouldn't get involved since there are multiple springs and streams....

If I had read the building code ahead of times...

Ben

 

[Tirediron]

All of what @ben wrote, is true in the modern "Civilization", and the ridicules amount of bureaucracy should have been nipped in the bud about 200 years ago, but no one chooses to stir the pot, so here we sit on the razors edge of tyranny

 

[Neb]

All of what @ben wrote, is true in the modern "Civilization", and the ridicules amount of bureaucracy should have been nipped in the bud about 200 years ago, but no one chooses to stir the pot, so here we sit on the razors edge of tyranny

Wax poetic why don't you?



Ben

 

[Magus]

Anyway I was wondering what you all do for fuel storage?

I opted for a selection of 5 gallon food grade drums that had cooking oil in them, the reason for this is I once used 55 gallon stainless steel acid drums until a seam split and at that time a hundred bucks spilled out on the ground. if you go my way, put them on pallets to ensure ventilation.
Note I no longer store fuel, no money to invest in it. food lasts longer.

 

[Tirediron]

Automotive propane tanks, much thicker shell, designed to handle pressure, usually cheap or free can be sealed to avoid the loss of light ends,

 

[montanabill]

55 gallon oil drums with tight fitting bungs. I have stored gas for two years this way. I take my five, five gallon plastic jugs to the gas station and then transfer to the drums. The drums will puff up a bit if exposed to high temps. I set mine on pallets and then cover them up to look like the rest of the junk. easy to get the gas out with a siphon or inexpensive pump. Ethanol free gas is 5.99 a gallon right now here in montana.

 

[Biggkidd]

Automotive propane tanks, much thicker shell, designed to handle pressure, usually cheap or free can be sealed to avoid the loss of light ends,

There are several projects around here I'd like to have decommissioned 500 & 1000 gallon tanks for. Maybe even one 5,000 gallon to use for a hot water heat storage for home heating.

 

[Tirediron]

Big tanks are harder to find, but often there are anhydrous ammonia tanks that become available, they also tend to have lots of ports an top side liquid taps.
For fuel storage I preffer pick up bed propane tanks, decent volume, moveable with a machine, but to heavy to carry off by humans. also helps with date and rotation.

 

[The Lazy L]

...It may be prudent to check a delivery company to ensure they are not restricted in what types of containers they can fill. Better to find out ahead or time....

Ben

Yep. When we built our house the "powers to be" determine because we have a high water table (we don't) a mound type of $anitary $ewer $ystem would have to be installed. I told my Contractor NO, I'm going with a conventional finger system. Contractor told me IF he could find a subcontractor willing to do it and IF we got caught the subcontractor would lose his permit for operating in the county. I went with the mound system.

My conversation with the county went like this:

Me. Why do I need a mound system?

County. Because you have a high water table.

Me. Can you explain why they dug a basement over 8 feet deep and why the excavation stayed dry with no water intrusion for over a month before the footer and foundations were poured?

County. Crickets softly chirping.

Me. Assuming that I have a high water table which I don't. The effluent from the septic tank is pumped to the mound. Does the effluent evaporate?

County. OH NO NO. Mound has a clay cap on it to prevent evaporation.

Me. Can't soak into the ground because of the high water table I don't have. Can't evaporate. So it's like a ballon you keep filling it until it bursts?

County. No. You're required to have a perimeter drain around the mound. In reality the effluent will filter though the mound and discharge out the perimeter drain to discharge into a ditch or something.

Me. Let's see if I understand. Because of a high water table I don't have I'm required to pump the septic tank effluent 100 feet out to a mound system. The effluent ends up the perimeter drain which comes back within 20 feet of septic tank to the ditch?

County. Yes that is correct.

Me. Then why don't we eliminate the effluent pump and pit, 100 feet of pipe to the mound, the mound and the 100 feet of drain pipe back and run the septic tank effluent 20 feet straight to the ditch? This discussion was over twenty years ago and I believe the County Agent that blast into orbit from my question is still in orbit today.

Yes I realize, because of my soil type, the septic tank effluent could have trouble percolating (soaking) into the soil. That's all County would have to say to stop my debate. But no they kept saying "high water table".
I find joy in pulling government bureaucrats chains.

 

[TeeJ]

Fair enough.

It may be prudent to check a delivery company to ensure they are not restricted in what types of containers they can fill. Better to find out ahead or time.

Sea story time

We excavated a short road for easy access to our private forest. Covered with gravel save for the last 20' where we had a contractor put in concrete to prevent the gravel from migrating to the hard top (my motorcycle buddy railed too many times about gravel on a roadway). And then the registered letter from the township arrived.

$1000 a day fine!

We scrambled to get a friend to cover the concrete with his bobcat and erase all of the work and cost we invested.

If I had known the "driveway" I would have opted out.

Better to know ahead of time.

Background mini rant

I could put in the driveway but I needed a permit.
I could get a permit with an optional variance for the property primary purpose.
But this primary purpose is a house.
But I don't a house there.
Building even a minimal house would require water sewage and electrical. Let's pretend the epa wouldn't get involved since there are multiple springs and streams....

If I had read the building code ahead of times...

Ben

Reminds me a story about what happened when I lived back in Ohio. Guy puts in permits for a chain link fence around the entire perimeter of his house. Planning commission approved, guy builds fence. Historic committee sees it and flips out, it's a "historically significant" house. Guy argues it's the towns fault - planning commission was responsible for seeing the age of the house and referring to hist comm, but didn't. City started threatening $20k/mo fines. Guy stands his ground and counter sues for city to pay for historically appropriate fence. Guys brother happens to be a really good lawyer. Guy ends up with a new fence and $20k in emotional damages - all for a situation that never should have happened!

 

[The Lazy L]

County was in the process of totally reconstruction of a road, adding lanes and straightening curves. Because of this the company I retired from was required to move its equipment. County issued us a permit for the new location. Several months after our equipment had been relocated a coworker came to me in panic. COUNTY IS INSISTING OUR RELOCATED EQUIPMENT IS IN THEIR WAY AND HAS TO BE MOVED. I showed the coworker our county approved engineering drawings. Our equipment is EXACTLY where the county approved. We‘ll move it again if county pays us to do so in advance. Their cost will be $100,000 to $125,000 and it will take six months. Coworker reported back that county decided our equipment was fine where it was.

Bureaucrats.

 

[Biggkidd]

Ordered a diesel pump from ebay this morning. 12V 10GPM Electric Diesel Oil Fuel Transfer Extractor Pump w/Nozzle Hose | eBay It's a portable unit with all the hoses etc. Hopefully it isn't a piece of junk. It was cheaper than just trying to buy a filter, hose and nozzle. For the time being I'm going to set a tank beside the hay shed. That will likely change later once more ground is opened up.