Yeah, it was nice having a lower power bill. I think we learned we could do with less though, and it was a good little survival exercise that yes, while it sucks, we can actually learn to live without AC. I'm going to get a timer for the thermostats, and see what we can do there. We already do this for the other big energy suck....the water heater, and that works out well.
What if ther was a power outage in america coursed by a cyber attach
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I have waited for a few weeks to respond to this thread, specifically to see what people would reflect in their ideas. I want to state that while I am no authority on the issue of cyber attacks, the chronic number of attacks launched by Chinese entities is particularly worrisome to both government and civilian businesses in the United States. In one particular entity known as APT-1, 141 companies have been singled out by this one group and this is only one group. Additionally, the Chinese government has spent millions in developing its ability to not only engage in cyberwarfare, but insulate itself from foreign attack, which should worry not only government officials, but the common American. We are not only talking about cyber attacks on utilities and financial institutions, but in just about anything we commonly do on the World Wide Web. You must remember, even today, the gas station fuel pumps run on a micro-circuitry and with the right virus, simple every day things we take for granted to include even the street lights could be affected under an attack. A scary thought, if your the one behind the wheel and at a busy cross-roads, when some jerk decides to attack the system and have every light turn green. How do we protect ourselves, I am completely unsure, I've asked this of my 16 year old computer geek and even he has no good responses. You simply can't harden everything as he pointed out and if you did, then computer networks would still be open to attack, once you open the keys to exchange information with another net. As he said, it would be like going back to the telegraph, where the line and the two receivers would be just it...nothing else.
As for software open to attacks...well for sure, if it were the utilities, for a period of time, we would experience discomfort. For me personally, that would mean we would lean heavily on our solar systems as our main power source and at times, when an extra energy source was needed go to the diesel and gas generators. None of these are open to cyberattacks since they are closed systems. I have a wind kit and battery at my storage location, so I suppose considering the local government would have their hands full, they wouldn't ticket me for breaking the local laws.
Areas also to be concerned with that might fall under attack, satellites that provide telecommunication and GPS. With the GPS down, people will have to go back to old fashion map reading. Radios, Satellite TV and national broadcasting may be affected. So a good old fashion shortwave might be our only alternative for news.
I have enclosed a small paragraph that I wrote as part of my thesis regarding China's on-going dispute in the Western Pacific regarding the South China Sea and East China Sea (Japan). At the time of my writing, the number of cyber attacks in the last five years has almost tripled compared to the preceding 10 years prior to 2009...their has been a decrease, possibly because Chinese entities have proved their theory that the United States is extremely vulnerable to cyberattacks and as a result is marshaling its resources/preventing counter steps in the event that it must use them against us.
One area not discussed above is China’s investment into cyber attack technology. The Chinese government and the PLA have vehemently denied that they are linked to recent cyber-attacks against the U.S. and other nation’s computer networks. China, in the last ten years, has invested in high tech war capabilities. The foundation includes controlling an adversary’s flow of information and maintains dominance through comprehensive computer network exploitation (Krekel, 2009). According to Krekel (2009), China is using its maturing computer network exploitation capability to support a sophisticated campaign of intelligence gathering against U.S. government and industry in order to increase their ability to sustain operations. The PLA again has no transparent document that outlines their planning and execution, which leads western analysts to highlight past incidents that link China’s ability to conduct an undeclared war against US interests. Theorists believe China will use it against unclassified or unsecure networks to delay deployments and combat effectiveness of supported forces in the region. The PLA has adopted cyber-attack and defense protocols into their operational planning. From 2002-2009, a total of 30 documented cyber-attacks, noteworthy enough to be included in the report, highlight Chinese hacker’s ability to attack potentially damaging information networks (Krekel, 2009). Figure 15 reflects the number of malicious cyber activities directed on U.S. Department of Defense Networks up to 2011 as reported to Congress. The U.S. government has been slow in developing systems to defeat attacks on their cyber systems and this lack luster ability may contribute to China’s ability to defeat U.S interests in the future.
Malicious Cyber Activities on U.S. Department of Defense Networks—Continued
Department of Defense Reported Incidents of Malicious Cyber Activity, 2001–2010, with Projection for 2011
FIGURE 12: Malicious Cyber Activities. Source: 2011 Report to Congress of the U.S.-CHINA ECONOMIC AND SECURITY REVIEW COMMISSION. * The figure for 2011 represents a projection based on incidents logged from January 1, 2011, to June 30, 2011. The projection assumes a constant rate of malicious activity throughout the year.
As for software open to attacks...well for sure, if it were the utilities, for a period of time, we would experience discomfort. For me personally, that would mean we would lean heavily on our solar systems as our main power source and at times, when an extra energy source was needed go to the diesel and gas generators. None of these are open to cyberattacks since they are closed systems. I have a wind kit and battery at my storage location, so I suppose considering the local government would have their hands full, they wouldn't ticket me for breaking the local laws.
Areas also to be concerned with that might fall under attack, satellites that provide telecommunication and GPS. With the GPS down, people will have to go back to old fashion map reading. Radios, Satellite TV and national broadcasting may be affected. So a good old fashion shortwave might be our only alternative for news.
I have enclosed a small paragraph that I wrote as part of my thesis regarding China's on-going dispute in the Western Pacific regarding the South China Sea and East China Sea (Japan). At the time of my writing, the number of cyber attacks in the last five years has almost tripled compared to the preceding 10 years prior to 2009...their has been a decrease, possibly because Chinese entities have proved their theory that the United States is extremely vulnerable to cyberattacks and as a result is marshaling its resources/preventing counter steps in the event that it must use them against us.
One area not discussed above is China’s investment into cyber attack technology. The Chinese government and the PLA have vehemently denied that they are linked to recent cyber-attacks against the U.S. and other nation’s computer networks. China, in the last ten years, has invested in high tech war capabilities. The foundation includes controlling an adversary’s flow of information and maintains dominance through comprehensive computer network exploitation (Krekel, 2009). According to Krekel (2009), China is using its maturing computer network exploitation capability to support a sophisticated campaign of intelligence gathering against U.S. government and industry in order to increase their ability to sustain operations. The PLA again has no transparent document that outlines their planning and execution, which leads western analysts to highlight past incidents that link China’s ability to conduct an undeclared war against US interests. Theorists believe China will use it against unclassified or unsecure networks to delay deployments and combat effectiveness of supported forces in the region. The PLA has adopted cyber-attack and defense protocols into their operational planning. From 2002-2009, a total of 30 documented cyber-attacks, noteworthy enough to be included in the report, highlight Chinese hacker’s ability to attack potentially damaging information networks (Krekel, 2009). Figure 15 reflects the number of malicious cyber activities directed on U.S. Department of Defense Networks up to 2011 as reported to Congress. The U.S. government has been slow in developing systems to defeat attacks on their cyber systems and this lack luster ability may contribute to China’s ability to defeat U.S interests in the future.
Malicious Cyber Activities on U.S. Department of Defense Networks—Continued
Department of Defense Reported Incidents of Malicious Cyber Activity, 2001–2010, with Projection for 2011
FIGURE 12: Malicious Cyber Activities. Source: 2011 Report to Congress of the U.S.-CHINA ECONOMIC AND SECURITY REVIEW COMMISSION. * The figure for 2011 represents a projection based on incidents logged from January 1, 2011, to June 30, 2011. The projection assumes a constant rate of malicious activity throughout the year.
Me neither, I got stuck between floors once but managed to prise open the doors and climb up to the next level, bad luck if that had been 50 floors above me
WRT to AC, I've never had it and I have spent a lot of time up north in the tropics. Sure it's nice (and I do now have AC in my car) but it's hardly a necessity, I find a fan and a wet towel is almost as good. If you have to be presentable for a job that's a different story though, not a good look with a sweat-soaked shirt.
And as for "normal" power failures (storms, backhoe mistakes, etc), I went into town the other day and the whole town was blacked out, no ATMs, no fuel pumping, no sales in shops unless you had cash etc. For a minute I though it was all on
But until I drove into town I didn't even know there was a problem. Really, get onto solar and you won't care what happens to the grid unless it's off for months and affects services.
In the event of a power outage pretty much i rely on torches, a butane camping stove for cooking and charging my mobile phone via the lighter plug in my car
I'd love to get into solar, but just too expensive. We certainly get the sun for it, but FL is nearly anti-solar it seems. I do keep checking into it though. Bound to be cheaper at some point, and tech is always changing.
I've lost track of what I've spent over the years, maybe $20k or more all up on the truck, plus other systems on other vehicles, but we have a system that allows us to do pretty much everything you do in a house, microwave, 2 fridges, 2 computers, washing machine, TV etc. No AC, cooking or heating though, that's a bridge too far...well actually the system will run those sort of appliances (I even MIG welded with it a couple of times) but you can't really replace the power with the amount of panels you can fit on the roof of a truck. You can with a house though.
Panels are cheap these days, $1/W as opposed to $10/W when I bought my first ones. In my last Landcruiser I had a system that worked well, we lived off it in the bush for 3 months using 2 fridges and 1 laptop plus lights, camera and phone charging etc. That system probably cost < $2000 IIRC and it did most things you would need. Even my tiny Suzuki 4x4 has a small system with a single fridge and power point. The Suzuki system was less than $1000, it's ok but not quite good enough really for long term but I reckon $2000 would get a nice system you could live on using low power devices.
I bet most people here would think nothing of spending $1-2000 on a 5th rifle and scope, you need them as well but maybe have one less firearm and fit out the BOV or BOL to be independent of the grid. It depends a lot on what you are prepping for to I suppose but storms and power outages are a given, zombie apoc not so much.
As you can tell I'm something of a solar evangelist
Panels are cheap these days, $1/W as opposed to $10/W when I bought my first ones. In my last Landcruiser I had a system that worked well, we lived off it in the bush for 3 months using 2 fridges and 1 laptop plus lights, camera and phone charging etc. That system probably cost < $2000 IIRC and it did most things you would need. Even my tiny Suzuki 4x4 has a small system with a single fridge and power point. The Suzuki system was less than $1000, it's ok but not quite good enough really for long term but I reckon $2000 would get a nice system you could live on using low power devices.
I bet most people here would think nothing of spending $1-2000 on a 5th rifle and scope, you need them as well but maybe have one less firearm and fit out the BOV or BOL to be independent of the grid. It depends a lot on what you are prepping for to I suppose but storms and power outages are a given, zombie apoc not so much.
As you can tell I'm something of a solar evangelist
I completely want to go solar, but I'm on a 5 and a half acres property, with a good-sized home, small store, and stables, as well as a garage and workshop all to power. So I'd need a LOT of power. I have roofspace though, for lots of panels...just the expense. I would love to go partial, pieces at a time, but the power company makes it so frickin' difficult.
Yeah I understand, I have a mate with what sounds like a similar property, his system cost $50,000 IIRC, and that was just for starters, he has since doubled the panels and added batteries and other stuff. They do just about everything on that system with almost no regard to using power, in fact I built my motorhome there and only had to run the gennie for the heavy 3-phase welding.
One thing to remember is that it's not the amount of stuff you need to power, it's the number of things that will be on at the same time and how long things will be running, so even a huge workshop can be run if say there's only a single worker because you only use one tool at a time generally. When I was building the RV if my mate was also working I would for example not use the cutoff saw was while he was welding, that sort of thing, didn't matter for drills etc, just high-power tools. And if you are willing to forgo welding while the missus is washing that cuts the system down a lot.
Sounds like the FL powers that be aren't helping, same in many places I gather. One can only wonder why that would be...actually the cynic in me has a fair idea
Anyway I'll stop banging on about solar, we all gotta work with what we can afford to implement given our respective finances, governments and societies.
One thing to remember is that it's not the amount of stuff you need to power, it's the number of things that will be on at the same time and how long things will be running, so even a huge workshop can be run if say there's only a single worker because you only use one tool at a time generally. When I was building the RV if my mate was also working I would for example not use the cutoff saw was while he was welding, that sort of thing, didn't matter for drills etc, just high-power tools. And if you are willing to forgo welding while the missus is washing that cuts the system down a lot.
Sounds like the FL powers that be aren't helping, same in many places I gather. One can only wonder why that would be...actually the cynic in me has a fair idea
Anyway I'll stop banging on about solar, we all gotta work with what we can afford to implement given our respective finances, governments and societies.
its really simple. The power companies are highly invested in the capital equipment required for their business. They would not want you to generate your own power and "sell back" coz so many of you would be doing so. But seriously, Solar is the way to go.
Understand that in Australia, land rights is an issue but if the central part of Australia can be tapped to solar and battery technologies can improve, we can easily power the entire continent just on Solar. But I digress.
I wish I could own a landed home or RV in Singapore and run it off Solar. But land scarce Singapore, its tough.
Understand that in Australia, land rights is an issue but if the central part of Australia can be tapped to solar and battery technologies can improve, we can easily power the entire continent just on Solar. But I digress.
I wish I could own a landed home or RV in Singapore and run it off Solar. But land scarce Singapore, its tough.
Yeah I understand, I have a mate with what sounds like a similar property, his system cost $50,000 IIRC, and that was just for starters, he has since doubled the panels and added batteries and other stuff. They do just about everything on that system with almost no regard to using power, in fact I built my motorhome there and only had to run the gennie for the heavy 3-phase welding.
One thing to remember is that it's not the amount of stuff you need to power, it's the number of things that will be on at the same time and how long things will be running, so even a huge workshop can be run if say there's only a single worker because you only use one tool at a time generally. When I was building the RV if my mate was also working I would for example not use the cutoff saw was while he was welding, that sort of thing, didn't matter for drills etc, just high-power tools. And if you are willing to forgo welding while the missus is washing that cuts the system down a lot.
Sounds like the FL powers that be aren't helping, same in many places I gather. One can only wonder why that would be...actually the cynic in me has a fair idea
Anyway I'll stop banging on about solar, we all gotta work with what we can afford to implement given our respective finances, governments and societies.
Gazrok is right, its not cheap. Take a look at "Off Topic" forum, dated 22 March, that I wrote about my home system. Gazrok and Myrrph had good comment then.
On a side note, we've tweeked the system even more since I last commented and now have another battery that is mobile one. Besides my Yeti's, this is a big plus. Anyway, we added a few more panels, so its even cut our energy costs even more. Of course, my family is big energy users, so it helps to have this in our corner. My friend and I did a dry run and then actually an exercise to see how long it would take us to pull down all the panels, and figured excluding an immediate event, we could get all the panels down, packed in a container, which I just bought and loaded into our trailer in about 3 hours. Copper wire, most of which can be salvaged and then the inverter/and primary battery can be taken off line, provided we kill the main circuit system. It wouldn't take us much time to get it operational at any location. Until then we have a wind power system and small generator that we can use to power up basic systems.
http://www.doomsdayprepperforums.co...-energy-choosing-between-solar-and-wind.3886/
this should be the post Bob's talking about
this should be the post Bob's talking about
I'm hoping that eventually the power companies play ball, and that the solar leasing companies can get more of a foothold in the state.
Solar leasing is actually pretty cool, from a prepper standpoint. They provide and own all the equipment, and they keep the tax break, while you pay a monthly lease fee (which at least is steady, vs. fluctuating power use), that is generally cheaper than your power bill would be. Thing is, if the SHTF, you still have the equipment all there, doing what it does...hehe....
Solar leasing is actually pretty cool, from a prepper standpoint. They provide and own all the equipment, and they keep the tax break, while you pay a monthly lease fee (which at least is steady, vs. fluctuating power use), that is generally cheaper than your power bill would be. Thing is, if the SHTF, you still have the equipment all there, doing what it does...hehe....
Hey, hope all is well in Florida...will venturing soon out your way for Orlando and Panama City. I hadn't heard about solar leasing, but locally, we are starting to get tons of wind farms in the nearby counties. They've started three wind farms just the west of our county and the three that are built just South and South East of us are bringing an economic boom. Helps when we are still in the emergency drought mode, no companies will invest in manufacturing without water. So the wind farm energy will help defray the economic loss. Our county government is still hedging and doesn't want to bring in a company like B.P., but they are a bit reactionary and not progressive to think out of the box. However, the wind farms that have sprouted all over Texas have helped out with schools, road pavement.
Makes sense that if you lease, their will be some help, but I will have our system paid off in another 5 more years. We generate quite a bit because we get total sunshine here. Our panels face directly south, so we get a pretty good amount of it hitting the panels.
As for the panels, well all that will be standing is the monolith frame.
Hey, hope all is well in Florida...will venturing soon out your way for Orlando and Panama City. I hadn't heard about solar leasing, but locally, we are starting to get tons of wind farms in the nearby counties. They've started three wind farms just the west of our county and the three that are built just South and South East of us are bringing an economic boom. Helps when we are still in the emergency drought mode, no companies will invest in manufacturing without water. So the wind farm energy will help defray the economic loss. Our county government is still hedging and doesn't want to bring in a company like B.P., but they are a bit reactionary and not progressive to think out of the box. However, the wind farms that have sprouted all over Texas have helped out with schools, road pavement.
Makes sense that if you lease, their will be some help, but I will have our system paid off in another 5 more years. We generate quite a bit because we get total sunshine here. Our panels face directly south, so we get a pretty good amount of it hitting the panels.
As for the panels, well all that will be standing is the monolith frame.
Darn Computers
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