OPSEC with your preps

[Alwaysready]

Always Ready --- I truly liked the fact that you had already established who was welcome and who was not welcome. Not just in your minds but in the minds of those people that were involved. They know where they stand, no surprises. The only flaw in that process (that I see) is that they may at some point barter that information regarding your preps for their own well being.

Good point keep in mind that they are 2000 miles away. Have never been east of Las Vegas. They know that I stand on my word in fact second DIL was not allowed in my house for 2 years. Once my son told her that he loved her and his mother then finished by saying he could get another wife but only had one mother.

 

[The Innkeeper]

Good point keep in mind that they are 2000 miles away. Have never been east of Las Vegas. They know that I stand on my word in fact second DIL was not allowed in my house for 2 years. Once my son told her that he loved her and his mother then finished by saying he could get another wife but only had one mother.

appreciate where you are coming from but gotta say that you son had the wrong answer for marriage. The spouse comes first ... period ... then your kids ... the parents and other family members. I realize that dysfunctions can get in the way of that line up but anything else is a marriage killer. Don’t get me wrong, I am glad he lives his momma but I think he was wrong in that call.

 

[TMT Tactical]

Good point keep in mind that they are 2000 miles away. Have never been east of Las Vegas. They know that I stand on my word in fact second DIL was not allowed in my house for 2 years. Once my son told her that he loved her and his mother then finished by saying he could get another wife but only had one mother.

Always Ready. It is nice that the people exclude are so far away. It does eliminate the problem of passed on information. If the villains can travel 2000 miles, then they don't need your supplies.

appreciate where you are coming from but gotta say that you son had the wrong answer for marriage. The spouse comes first ... period ... then your kids ... the parents and other family members. I realize that dysfunctions can get in the way of that line up but anything else is a marriage killer. Don’t get me wrong, I am glad he lives his momma but I think he was wrong in that call.

Now this rely is intended for both Always ready and for B.O.B.. After my divorce, I later became engaged. My boys did not like the new Fiancée and she did everything possible to drive a wedge between me and my sons. She succeeded to the point my youngest son did not communicate with me for 23 years. My oldest son did keep in contact but on a very limited basis. Now with that background in mind, I still have not resolved the priorities for the wife vs the parent vs children. Should I have shown more loyalty to my sons or to my potential future wife? Fortunately the engagement fell apart and my wife is a strong believer in family. Her kids (all four) and my kids (2 sons) are considered our kids, not step children. So with that being said, I think the answer is determined with each circumstance. If the wife supports the family, then no ranking is needed. If the children do not accept a new wife, then the children may need to be placed second to the wife. It is a complex relationship problem.

 

[The Innkeeper]

Always Ready. It is nice that the people exclude are so far away. It does eliminate the problem of passed on information. If the villains can travel 2000 miles, then they don't need your supplies.



Now this rely is intended for both Always ready and for B.O.B.. After my divorce, I later became engaged. My boys did not like the new Fiancée and she did everything possible to drive a wedge between me and my sons. She succeeded to the point my youngest son did not communicate with me for 23 years. My oldest son did keep in contact but on a very limited basis. Now with that background in mind, I still have not resolved the priorities for the wife vs the parent vs children. Should I have shown more loyalty to my sons or to my potential future wife? Fortunately the engagement fell apart and my wife is a strong believer in family. Her kids (all four) and my kids (2 sons) are considered our kids, not step children. So with that being said, I think the answer is determined with each circumstance. If the wife supports the family, then no ranking is needed. If the children do not accept a new wife, then the children may need to be placed second to the wife. It is a complex relationship problem.

@TMT Tactical No doubt second or third or fourth marriages and children complicate matters greatly and every situation is different. Like any general rule of thumb you start from the rule and work outwards. It certainly isn’t always as clean cut as I suggested, but there are principles at play.

 

[TMT Tactical]

@TMT Tactical No doubt second or third or fourth marriages and children complicate matters greatly and every situation is different. Like any general rule of thumb you start from the rule and work outwards. It certainly isn’t always as clean cut as I suggested, but there are principles at play.

B.O.B. I do agree that there are certain principals to be followed. It is very difficult for me to express myself in a written format (bad spelling, grammar, typos and poor writing skills) but I have still not to this day, determined a viable ranking system for wives, children, in-laws and such. I just do like I always do, take it one day at a time with regards to personal relations. Too complicated for my simple mind to express.

 

[The Innkeeper]

B.O.B. I do agree that there are certain principals to be followed. It is very difficult for me to express myself in a written format (bad spelling, grammar, typos and poor writing skills) but I have still not to this day, determined a viable ranking system for wives, children, in-laws and such. I just do like I always do, take it one day at a time with regards to personal relations. Too complicated for my simple mind to express.

@TMT Tactical you seem to express yourself clearly as far as I can tell. In a one marriage situation I think it’s pretty clear, but many dont have the blessing of having that.

Even with a general ranking order in our mind each situation and decision must be taken individually. I have been married to the same woman for more than 40 years and have good relationships with my boys, their wives and their children, and with both our moms (both fathers are deceased) most of the time it’s pretty simple but not always. On the other hand most of our extended family is pretty toxic so that becomes very easy, they don’t even enter the picture.

 

[Peanut]

Yes, it matters. be it physical or mental.

Preps are not all about how much is stashed on the shelf... it can be something as simple as camouflaged gardening (plants valued as food, but not readily known as a food crop), or other primitive skills

Sadly everyone for miles around know I have primitive skills and know a ton about plants, medicinal and edible. More than a few have taken one of my classes. I do what I need to do for a few extra bucks! I just don't want to find myself in the position you did... I'm sure that was horrible for you.

 

[Grizzleyette___Adams]

Sadly everyone for miles around know I have primitive skills and know a ton about plants, medicinal and edible. More than a few have taken one of my classes. I do what I need to do for a few extra bucks! I just don't want to find myself in the position you did... I'm sure that was horrible for you.

Yes, the experience was horrible but not the worst thing that ever happened or could happen again. I try to keep things in perspective: everything in this life is temporary and keeping strong spiritually is more important to me than being fearful of what can kill me. Fear can rob us of life, more than the bad guys can.

I'm in the same boat as you, Peanut...For many years, I have been teaching others the same things as you have.

If I ever found myself in a bad spot again, I know that what worked for me and King David (1 Samuel 21: 13-15) can work again. Who would want anything from someone who went pure-D crazy?

I be like, "Here, have some grubs m'dear." Or, I might give them something that tastes quite crappy but harmless. (Heh, maybe Boneset herb?)

I am not kidding about the bugs. Incorporate edible insects in your Wild Edibles classes like I do! Develop a reputation now. My insects-as-food curriculum is well-advertised and offered as an optional class. So yeah, lots of folks know. And it has not hurt my bottom line dollar wise one bit. I look at it as insurance for my future...

(But don't let on how tasty those roasted June Bugs are, and how they really do taste a little like malted chocolate; don't let on how you can roast crickets and grasshoppers and pulverize them beyond all recognition to remove the ick-factor, and make a nutritious and tasty broth with them...)

Them's your ace in the hole. For your knowledge only. Don't let your dear loved ones know! They don't need to know what-all you put into the tea water, lol.

It is fine and good that you and me know stuff, but that don't mean everything needs to be all that tasty. The stuff you have taught will serve others well, and those people will not bother you. If the uneducated come to you during SHTF, you can always do what I mentioned in posts #52, #66. And lament the fact that the violet leaves are out of season, or that the danged deer ate all the delicious 'shrooms, or...whatever. (I plan on mentioning that the maggots growing on that rat I killed a few days ago are about ready to be harvested and is high in needed fats and protein, which is 100% truth.)

I am sure we can come up with lots of creative things, lol. This kind of planning keeps me in good spirits and the comic relief does wonders to dispel anxiety, too.

 

[Resto]

The Fed-ex man knows every prepper in the county. So much for opsec.

Don't worry. Every Computer model Ive looked at says 80% to 90% Die Off by 90 days without Electricity. When the food runs out, they will eat each other. Problem Solved.

 

[Resto]

And the mail person.

That's the people we really need to worry about. They are under Homeland Security now. But I don't think there will be much left after 90 Days accept the Military. Bummer. The Fed is Prepped.

 

[Caribou]

You can only do so much with OPSEC. The wife wanted this house so this is the one we got. The only place for preps is the garage but sometimes the only access is the garage so people get to see the preps. New appliances get delivered, neighbors drop by unexpectedly, the easiest way for people with mobility problems to enter, **** happens. I do the best that I can and I'll deal with the problems if I ever have to.

 

[Grizzleyette___Adams]

Here's how I OPSEC-proof my buckets:

I make super sturdy "tables" with them: lay a large piece of plywood over the top of a gazillion buckets that are stacked 2-deep, cover the plywood with durable plastic tablecloths and use them as crafts work tables or gardening/potting tables. All buckets are camouflaged as described below.

Buckets are labeled with a sharpie pen and a few well-chosen words such as "craft supplies, ant poison, or paint for bedroom #2." If I ever had buckets that were pre-printed with a preparedness logo on them, I would sandpaper the logo off or transfer the contents to plain food-grade buckets.

Regardless of what I call them, I know what is inside by the color pen I used: one color for wheat, another color for rice, etc.

 

[Grizzleyette___Adams]

Most importantly, plan heavily for the day your last preps are used up. If you have plan B, C & D in place, you are not totally bereft in the event a tornado, or thieves take your preps out.

This might be a fantastic topic to explore in another thread.

 

[Grizzleyette___Adams]

If anyone is concerned with what-all the mailman "knows," then stop ordering through the mail and start prepping in other ways.

For example, locate a food co-op drop near you and pick up the stuff yourself every month. (Azure Standard, Country Life, etc. sells grains, beans and other great prep foods); buy frozen veggies and dehydrate them. You can dehydrate just about anything you can buy at a co-op or from the grocery, or from your garden. Jerky can be pulverized into broth powder; whole meals can be dehydrated (see the book, Backpack Gourmet by Linda Frederick Yaffe.)

FedEx, UPS, and USPS be damned. They don't need to be in the picture at all.

 

[Peanut]

I'm in the same boat as you, Peanut...For many years, I have been teaching others the same things as you have.
Them's your ace in the hole. For your knowledge only.
It is fine and good that you and me know stuff, but that don't mean everything needs to be all that tasty.

Then you know as well as I do there are a dozen or so of very special plants, half of which aren’t recognized by any state. I’m about to post one as soon as it blooms, it’s the signal of spring in the southeast. It was used for sedation during surgery from the 1850’s until about 1870 when opium became plentiful. There was a 20% mortality rate even when it was diluted to parts per million and administered by doctors..

In 1868 a man said the root tasted like “taters” in his stew, just before he died. There are some nasty plants out there…

 

[Grizzleyette___Adams]

Yes, and I am careful to never use the dangerous ones for any reason. Because there are so many poisonous look-alikes, the plants that I choose to teach others need to be pretty much fool-proof. Because, fools. lol

 

[Peanut]

Folks would be shocked to learn that “poison hemlock” “Conium maculatum” and “water hemlock”, "Cicuta virosa” are both powerful pain relievers, in the league of the most the most powerful opioids.

They are not addictive. Easy to use… but very dangerous! If you don’t know what you are doing, they will kill you in just a few hours (quite painfully).

 

[Alwaysready]

appreciate where you are coming from but gotta say that you son had the wrong answer for marriage. The spouse comes first ... period ... then your kids ... the parents and other family members. I realize that dysfunctions can get in the way of that line up but anything else is a marriage killer. Don’t get me wrong, I am glad he lives his momma but I think he was wrong in that call.

That was his response to an ultimatum she gave. I will agree that in my marriage Mrs. AR comes first.

 

[Grizzleyette___Adams]

Folks would be shocked to learn that “poison hemlock” “Conium maculatum” and “water hemlock”, Cicuta virosa” are both powerful pain relievers..... If you don’t know what you are doing, they will kill you in just a few hours (quite painfully).

That right there could be a long, long-lasting pain reliever, lol

In a severe or prolonged SHTF situation where access to a doctor is non-existent, I would not hesitate to use poppies (of a particular species) for critical or emergency pain relief. They are legal to grow, but what is illegal is scarification of the pods. They will grow from seeds that can be purchased in the spice section of well-stocked grocery stores. Some seed catalogs sell them too. However, these things can be quite dangerous as well. There is a fine line between being pain-free or dead.

I had to laugh when a landscaping business planted gorgeous (opium) poppies in a neighboring town's Courthouse/police station's lawn. Those things grew in all their poppiness glory, until one night they all disappeared, and were never planted there again.

 

[Caribou]

That right there could be a long, long-lasting pain reliever, lol

In a SHTF situation, I would not hesitate to use poppies (of a particular species). They are legal to grow, but what is illegal is scarification of the pods. They will grow from seeds that can be purchased in the spice section of well-stocked grocery stores. Some seed catalogs sell them too.

I had to laugh when a landscaping business planted gorgeous (opium) poppies in a neighboring town's Courthouse/police station's lawn. Those things grew in all their poppiness glory, until one night they all disappeared, and were never planted there again.

The same thing happened in CA. The CA state flower is the California Poppy. Someone substituted opium poppies in front of the Capitol Building.

 

[Grizzleyette___Adams]

I am laughing way harder than I should...the visuals will stick with me for a long time...opium pods waving in the breeze and all...

 

[TMT Tactical]

More great posts.

B.O.B.-- I am extremely happy that you found Mrs. B.O.B. and it has lasted 40 years. The fact you have such a good relationship with you sons, their wives and your mothers is a comfort and a blessing. Your ability to recognize your extended family is toxic is another point of wisdom. These known factors do help in future preps.

Peanut and Grizzleyette Adams -- the fact you are known locally for your botanical expertise, will aid you in the future. Grizzleyette suffered because she was trapped without good local support. She has now corrected that situation. Both of your skill sets will be in demand but not as forced labor. Your local communities will request your help because they will know you as good solid folks. I see your skill sets as a plus. You both "Bring Something to the Table". The fact you have knowledge of toxic plants is also your ace in the hole.

Resto -- I am not too worried about the Feds, Police or the Military. 95 percent of these people will all have families and will not be hanging around waiting for orders. They will be headed home to protect their loved ones. I am willing to bet most military families live off base, so the troops will be head home to protect.

Caribou --- I fully understand about the difficulty of concealing your preps. The act of living always throws some obstacles into our prepping plans. I cannot start the THH project for many years (hopefully). My wife struggled and sacrificed for most of her life and I will not ask her to sacrifice her future comforts for my desire to prep. I have food, water and firearms, that will have to do for now. The wifes remaining years are going to be as stress free as possible, she has earned it.

I think this thread has provide some very important insights for some future threads and I hope many of the posting members will take the lead and start more follow up threads.

 

[ssonb]

I suspect it's not quite as easy as books and movies would have us believe...........You are assuming that I can read and have enuf attention span to stay awake during a whole movie.......................

 

[Weedygarden]

You can only do so much with OPSEC. The wife wanted this house so this is the one we got. The only place for preps is the garage but sometimes the only access is the garage so people get to see the preps. New appliances get delivered, neighbors drop by unexpectedly, the easiest way for people with mobility problems to enter, **** happens. I do the best that I can and I'll deal with the problems if I ever have to.

My garage can be in view when people drive by when the door is open. I hung some hooks around the outside, leaving room for shelves, etc. I hung tarps in front of stuff that I didn't want the world to see. People are nosy though. I had a garage sale and someone asked what I had behind the tarps. I don't remember exactly what my response was, but something like "Stuff that I am not selling."

 

[fteter]

I'm a big believer in OPSEC. To the point that I may subtly encourage close to me to have some preparations on hand, but I never let the discussion spill over into what I've done. Only one exception to that rule: I do have a neighbor who has asserted (half seriously) that, if needed, he'll just come take it from the neighbors who have supplies on hand. I've sought out those neighbors, we've talked about how to handle the situation, and we've all agreed that Step 1 in any emergency situation will be to neutralize that threat.

Like Sewingcreations15, my wife and I are LDS. And we have a good local trading network set up. And, in keeping with our beliefs, we stock extra for those who need it. But we will not be handing out that extra directly to anyone. Instead we've arranged to make discrete contributions to the local church, who can then hand it out as they encounter the need. Granted that not everyone here is LDS, but I suspect most of us have a local church or service organization or soup kitchen that would love to receive contributions in an emergency situation.

 

[TMT Tactical]

I had a thought (surprising). When people suggest donating to a local charity in times of SHTF, is that like painting bullseye on those charities? In a full blow event, bad guys may decide it is easier to attack a local church vs. individual homes. It would be a much bigger score and probable a much safer target. How many charities /food banks are going to have armed guards prepared to shoot to kill? Think of the people killed handing out food or trying to deliver food in third world countries. In a major long term event, those same types of people will think nothing of raiding a local church or food bank. Just an point to consider.

 

[hiwall]

I had a thought (surprising). When people suggest donating to a local charity in times of SHTF, is that like painting bullseye on those charities? In a full blow event, bad guys may decide it is easier to attack a local church vs. individual homes. It would be a much bigger score and probable a much safer target. How many charities /food banks are going to have armed guards prepared to shoot to kill? Think of the people killed handing out food or trying to deliver food in third world countries. In a major long term event, those same types of people will think nothing of raiding a local church or food bank. Just an point to consider.

If things were that bad those charities could (and likely would) immediately distribute the stored supplies to the needy (at least that is what I would do). Those charities would have run out of everything they had stored long before things got very bad and any they received afterward would likely be smaller amounts that would be gone fast.

 

[angie_nrs]

I had a thought (surprising). When people suggest donating to a local charity in times of SHTF, is that like painting bullseye on those charities? In a full blow event, bad guys may decide it is easier to attack a local church vs. individual homes. It would be a much bigger score and probable a much safer target. How many charities /food banks are going to have armed guards prepared to shoot to kill? Think of the people killed handing out food or trying to deliver food in third world countries. In a major long term event, those same types of people will think nothing of raiding a local church or food bank. Just an point to consider.

That's a really good point. Also, who's going to man those charities?? Most of them around here are run by volunteers. Who's going to volunteer to do that if things really got that bad? I'm pretty sure those folks would be home taking care of their own.

I would not donate in a very desperate situation. I've seen trucks come into storm ravaged or water starved areas to hand out food packages and the crowd can be very dangerous. For my personal safety, I'd stay home. During the early period of a situation that could turn desperate, I would concentrate more on moving things to different areas that would not be readily found. In other words, I would be hiding my stuff in several different places, which is just not convenient to do now as food products should be used and consumed in a FIFO rotation. That's pretty difficult to do if you have several small stores of food all over the place.

 

[The Innkeeper]

Without wanting to get the thread to be booted to religion ... I struggle with all this. Where does the obligation to above and beyond the norm to help meet the rubber on the road of the security issues and simple pragmatic problems raised here? I don’t have an answer just the struggle.

 

[TMT Tactical]

B.O.B. I fully understand your struggle. I really wish I could present an alternative to this problem, but I have not found one. My only hope is that I will be far enough off the beaten track to not have to use my preparation and defenses. Survival can be a double edged sword, your survival at the cost of somebodies else's not surviving. I have looked at this part of the problem but have never found a safe way to help others without endangering my family / group. I would be thrilled if somebody wiser than me can help out in this area, it is just beyond me.